Ticket Cameras Used To Convict Drivers Without Their Knowledge
June 23rd, 2009 Posted in Red-Light Cameras, Speed Cameras
The law in the state of Oregon (and other states as well) simply says that citations “may be delivered by mail.” There is an article on OregonLive.com today that illustrates why this is a major flaw in Oregon’s red-light camera system.
The following excerpt from the OregonLive.com article, written by Stacy Mitchell, shows how this flaw can lead to drivers being convicted without knowledge of ever even having been charged:
I live in Maine. Several weeks ago I received a call from someone working collections for Multnomah County. He said I owed the county $353. I was baffled.
It took some time on the phone to sort out what he was talking about. Apparently, while visiting Portland two years ago, in May 2007, I was photographed running a red light.
I was driving a rental car at the time. The rental company turned over my name and driver’s license number. But rather than sending the ticket to my current address — the one on my driver’s license at the time and on file with the Maine Department of Motor Vehicles — officials mailed it to an address I had not lived at for more than four years.
The envelope was returned unopened, but county officials made no further effort to locate me. They did not contact the Maine DMV. Nor did they look in the phone book, where I am, and was at the time, listed.
My court date came in October 2007. Since I failed to show up, I was convicted at the highest fine level. A few months later, with the fine unpaid and me still completely in the dark, Oregon imposed additional fees and suspended my driver’s license.
The suspension was sent out on a national database, which means that, had I been pulled over anywhere in the country in the last year and a half, I could have faced a steep fine and even arrest for driving with a suspended license.
That was not the only consequence of my secret conviction. Shortly after the call from the collections agent, my husband and I were, to our surprise, unable to refinance our mortgage. I learned that my credit score had plummeted almost 200 points, all because of a single item reported in March of this year, long before I received that first phone call: a “seriously past due” fine owed to Multnomah County Circuit Court.
You can read the full article here.
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This *may* violate due process under Jones v. Flowers (2005 SCOTUS case). See: http://supremecourtus.gov/opinions/05pdf/04-1477.pdf
Does it matter whether this is legal or not? What kind of Country would even allow something like this to occur in the first place?
Given a choice of revenue or freedom and privacy, revenue will always win out – at least, it seems, in the US.
Has anyone verified that the story is actually correct? Anyone can post stories on the internet and a lot of them are false.
Randy why do you even bother coming to this website? Obviously anything can be posted on the internet, so why do you even come to this website? I wouldnt put it past any gov’t doing what oregon did, especially my state of MD.
Stories like this show why with the rampant dishonesty contained within the Scamera industry only a greedy idiot would support scameras .
All this story says is that when you do not update either your drivers License or your vehicle registration it can cause you problems. The whole story was about a person breaking the law and the state sending the ticket to the address listed for the individual. No where does the state keep old information for a drivers license or a vehicle registration from 4 years ago.
Again you state something that in no way is related to the story . In the story it is stated that his correct address was on his license .
“I was driving a rental car at the time. The rental company turned over my name and driver’s license number. But rather than sending the ticket to my current address — the one on my driver’s license at the time and on file with the Maine Department of Motor Vehicles — officials mailed it to an address I had not lived at for more than four years.”
Why don’t you at least read the story before you post Randy . On your idiotic theory we should expect things like tickets to be sent to wrong address even if we have followed all the rules and changed our address if we have moved . Go crawl back under your rock ………..
southernboy I can read just fine. Where in the hell did the address come from then if it was not from the drivers license or registration? No this is all about writing a false article is what it looks like to me. You have to remember that the person that wrote the article is an activist so do you need to know more.
A couple of things ,
have you ever looked up anyone on the web or a credit report or your DL on the DMV computer ?? I say anyone because from your “writings” I suspect you don’t have a history to track yet . All of the above lists every address you’ve ever had so something like this is more than plausible .
And I guess they haven’t taught you to spell yet in your third grade class ,” it’s spelled writing not righting ” .{ southernboy I can read just fine. Where in the hell did the address come from then if it was not from the drivers license or registration? No this is all about righting a false article is what it looks like to me.}
Your comprehension , language and spelling skills will develop with age & experience . Now drink your milk , go to your room turn off your computer and do your homework , LOL…………;~)
southernboy I do not see your rightings but thanks for having such a good spelling site because it sucks as a place to get facts. There are more things exagerated and more police that are trashed on this site than is possible. If there are a handfull of bad police out there then get rid of them but there are thousands out there that are very good but you like to trash them for doing their job.
From what your comments state you would prefer people to drive with drugs in there cars and in their bodies. Why should the police possibly want to save your ass because as you say all should be able to drive impaired so why are police out there? Why should they want to have people stop at stop signs or drive at a safe speed or not drive dunk or on drugs? Why would they want to save your ass and eveyone else?
and I put “there” in my last post just to make your day.
I guess in your world Randy ,
Scameras companies and governments haven’t been caught time and again shortening yellows just to increase funds brought in from red light cameras ????
How about the fact that the shortening of yellows increases accidents at intersections ??
Or how about the fact that lengthened yellows reduces accidents and does away with Scameras income ??
How about all the manipulated data collected by the Scameras industry used by many states to back up their claims on Scameras impacts ??
Or the fact that state mandated in law warning signs of Scameras traps are many times closer than mandated , are always minimum in size , low in site placement and off in color as for them not to stand out just increase revenue . And now many of the vans in use are painted in colors that more easily blend in , I guess that is to not impact wildlife , LOL…………….
The Scameras industry is one of the most dishonest & corrupt industries to ever exist and this list is including tobacco sales companies , the facts are piling up to back this fact up .
southernboy I see that you are the idiot that believes everything that the theNewspaper.com prints. If you want to prove that you are right then go and time the yellow lights yourself and I will bow down to your thenewspaper.com if you are correct. I will bet you anything that they are wrong. They often search the country high and low for bits of facts years old and then slant it their direction with lies and then they print it.
southernboy I do not agree with your statement
“Or how about the fact that lengthened yellows reduces accidents and does away with Scameras income ??”
Once the true idiot realizes that yellow lights are longer they will start to enter an intersection later than ever thus you will still have a red light running problem. Think for yourself if you can, what would you do if the yellow light increased a couple of seconds? You and most here would compensate and enter an intersection later than ever because you and others here would not wait for up to a minute for the other lane of traffic to turn yellow and then wait another 7 or 8 seconds or whatever you come up with or would you try to skip through on a yellow light? Pretty obvious to me. A yellow light should be timed to allow a safe stop and not add another 3 or 4 seconds or cut it a second or two either.
That is a load of crap. [I'd be more worried about tractor/trailers which have light stopping ability]
Studies have shown increased compliance with a correct yellow light interval.
For your hypothetical ‘true idiot’, an increased, or added, mutual red light eliminates that problem-even if you have to take a half to whole second off the increased yellow light.
George You did not read my statement. ” A yellow light should be timed to allow a safe stop” A safe stop definition is not slamming on your brakes.
What I was saying was that no matter what yellow light timing you have if there is no enforcement at the lights at all there will be people speeding up when they see a yellow light and will enter the intersection when it is red to save them time. That is why the red light cameras were put into place in the first place. You get all people to stop doing that and you will not need any enforcement. In fact there would be no tickets given even if there was enforcement. If you have not seen people speed up on a yellow to try to make it through then you must be blind.
Many intersection already have your mutual red light you were recommending.
George, this is part of a linked study that this web site supports for red light safety:
“Enforcement efforts are likely to reduce violations occurring primarily in the first few seconds of red and, therefore, should significantly reduce left-turn-opposed crashes. In an indirect manner, these efforts should also reduce some right-angle crashes by encouraging driver compliance with the signal.”
What a croc. On 7-6-09, Albuquwerky sent me a ‘present’ in the mail. On June 27th, 2009, I was eastbound on I-40 at the Carlisle exit with my family, returning home to Tx from an AZ vacation. My speed? 57–oh, but wait, they say it was in a 45 mph work zone. Sent me a nice picture of the rear of my Sienna and if I would be so kind as to send them $75, they won’t notify my state or insurance company and promise to keep it off my record (I don’t have a record, not having received a ticket in over 33 years). Those rat bastards said I could return to dispute the allegations by their mobile speed officer manning the camera, but I risk paying $50 more for my brashness plus the $75 if I didn’t make my case.
I have a nephew checking that particular part of I-40 and whether there was indeed a fair warning about the drop in speed from 55 to 45 and if it is a construction zone (no workers present that day). He thinks they go after out-of-state vehicles in particular because they’ll pay up, not being willing or financially able to return; when he showed up in court to fight a ticket the officer was a no show, case dismissed. So how bad can they screw me from afar if i don’t pay up? I welcome any and all responses or comments.
I had the same problem…June 27 (same date!), same intersection, with an out-of-state plate from Kansas. I hadn’t seen any signs indicating that the speed limit changed from 55 to 45 (none are visible in the picture), and I didn’t see any workers out there either. Were you ever able to get a picture of the interstate? I’d like to be able to contest the ticket, but the burden of proof is on us, somehow, and not on the state….
Thanks for the feedback; too bad it trapped you too. My cousin went by that site and said there is no camera there now but there are still construction barrels and apparent ongoing construction. Am sending him a scan of the picture they sent of me so he can better tell where it might have been taken. I asked him to look for any warnings about the speed being reduced from 55 to 45; he doesn’t recall seeing any but will check again. In my opinion, it’s not fair for there not to be such a warning, and I was only going 57. How ’bout you? I hear what you’re saying about the burden of proof being on us.